AMiBA PROJECT WEEKLY MEETING MINUTES

Date: 24/August/2000

Attendants: B. Martin, H. Wang's 2 students, M. Sinclair, W. Wilson, M. Kesteven, J. Peterson, M.T. Chen, Eugene Hwang , C.W. Wang, P. Shaw, J. Wang

Issues

Description

Action by

Output

MMIC- W- Band InP HEMT LNA

  1. The Sub Hamonic Mixer’s chip test result at ATNF is not as good as the design goal of H. Wang, the next step is to test the device, and investigate the module to find out the problem.
  2. Mal inputs some comments on the receiver components design goals by email to Huei, further discussing on that issue was continuing at this meeting, conclusions are Summarized as following :

InP HEMT LNA - 25dB gain is what Fred asked at PDR meeting, Huei suggests put on 17dB and cast two later. Mal agrees with this. Huei is going to run a noise simulation to verify whether 17dB and cast that two is ok. Then he will take care of the potential observation problem. Right now, according to Mal's suggestion, Huei put on 15dBband instead of 17 dB mid band. ±2dB gain flatness is suitable for overall system, so we don't need to change it. For the I/O return loss, Huei discussed with Todd about whether we need across band, Todd thinks 10dB probably is difficult to get for such wide band. Mal said that he doesn't have this data right now, but it is certainly that 15dB is for mid band, and the 10dB across band are also concerned. Huei said that after Mal got the test data on his w-band chips, he would look at if we need to change that figure. So we leave it until Mal got that data, then we come back to check it is 7dB or 8dB. For the noise temp. Mal said 45K is not a crucial number, it is a system requirement, basically 75K is for the overall system temp. for LNA.

Huei has checked with Todd for a published data, and Todd think it is tough to put 45K over the band, and Huei suggests to put on a comment column on the spec sheet to see is it risky or not.

    1. um GaAs HEMT HEMT -

gain stage LNA- Huei said we can take Mal's input on gain flatness ± 1dB on the spec.

subharmonically pumped mixer - Mal suggests to put on -30~10dBm for RF power.

LO power amplifier - Mal suggests to add a doubler to increase its frequency to 84GHz, Huei is going to find out if he has enough manpower to do it or not.

Gilbert cells multiplier - Warwick's comments: the input level specs. Should be thought of in terms of gaussian noise signal; the IF must go down to DC, this is a good way of getting a bit more gain by way of IF amplifier, and also solving the problem of the DC bias on the output ; the input match could be a important factor in the lag correlator, he suggests 15 dB return loss on both inputs is good for a bit better match ; for an overall flatness, he suggests ±2dB is what we should be aiming for ; we need a differential output design for IF, but in RF and LO, we need a single ended design for HEMT to achieve the required band width ; he also suggests Huei to contact Paul Roberts and pick his brains on the various design considerations.

* As to the heat dispersion of the RF MMIC components, Mintang asks Huei to provide that data.

Jeff suggests we should use the responsivity or sensitivity instead of conversion loss, and he also suggests the LO power should be -23dBm instead of -20dBm.

* For further discussion, Huei will write down his questions and email them to Paul Roberts, Jeff and Warwick.

Waveguide filter - Mal thinks it is the tough one, but from a system point of view, these numbers are reasonable. So Huei will pass it to

Prof. Wu, let him to check if he can follow the design goals to build a module.

3. We received a formal quotation from NRAO for 4 units of 82~106 GHz amplifiers, delivery for the first two units is on or before

Nov. 31, 2000, delivery for the remaining 2 units is on or before July 31, 2001. Now, await Fred's approval for ordering .

4.No news from Todd Gaier for loaning two units of JPL's LNA modules, Huei will follow up it.

5. Huie has modified the design goals for MMIC components; Paul will email that sheet to everyone to review after this meeting.

6. Mal said he got the first chip back from TRW for InP LNA, at present they try very hard to get them into the amplifier test, as

soon as they have some number on that test. He will let us know.

M. Sinclair

 

 

 

H. Wang

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

H.Wang

 

 

H. Wang

 

K.Y. Lo

 

P. Shaw

H. Wang

P.Shaw

Ongoing

 

 

 

DONE

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ASAP

 

 

Done

 

Ongoing

 

Ongoing

Ongoing

ASAP

Lag correlator hybrid

1.For the 17 lag correlator, Jeff said the Gramic is till working on that, he don't expect anything for several more weeks.

2.For the Gilbert Cell Multiplier spec, H. Wang reminds J. Peterson to generate a specification to help S.S. Shen and his student to design

that amplifier. He also asks W. Wilson to give his comment on that spec. He hopes to read and to discuss their inputs in the next week.

3.Huei said that according the Fushimi's paper; the diode mixer has a worse loss than the conventional mixer at RF &LO powers input. He

will email that paper to Jeff to review. Jeff agreed to compare it with what he has made in his lab. Jeff will also email everyone the responsive result in lab

4.Jeff said that the email he did send around , what he realize that the signal level arriving both Gilbert Cell and mixers are quiet small, in

few microwatts (-25dBm). The division of tree structure to be made with the resistor, which make that structure much smaller. Warwick

says the resistor is much lower in the tree structure, and it certainly is the advantage to achieve that bandwidth as we talk about. The

structure will be bigger than the structure of Gilbert Cell itself, probably twice as big. Jeff will keep on thinking about an idea of merit.

He may try it, perhaps to build one. He will talk with Paul about later to see what he think.

5. Jeff said the progress of the Gramic today about switching that they are thinking for us for the tree structure and the resistance divider.

This makes the two technology re-testing as different as possible, and we learn more as we do that way, so his suggestion is that

we do that by the tree structure with mixer from that MMICs, and then we go continuously with the delay line lag correlator. Warwick

says he have not decided definitely on that structure. But he will come out some simulation with other work they do. Jeff said he would

like better for what he try, so he probably will go ahead that direction. Warwick agrees with Jeff to choose that mixer tree structure.

6. Warwick said he is still waiting for the HBT Gilbert Cell multipliers coming back, and last week we heard TRW will deliver them in

early September. Presently, he is working on the 4 GHz lag correlator by using the commercial Gilbert Cell multipliers, he should have

something comes out in a couple of weeks, he hopes.

5. Layout of the circuit board - Jeff is thinking about how to layout the circuit board to accommodate the correlator self, LN DC

multipliers, converter and custom chips. He thinks those item probably take us a good realistic, and may be a square inch or two? if we

are lucky. Warwick is also thinking a little bit about how to put them together, he thinks we need more information to figure out a lot of

matters. Jeff suspects Taida is capable to built the hybrid chips with CMOS technology.

J. Peterson

J. Peterson

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

J. Peterson

 

J.Peterson

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

T.D. Chiueh

Ongoing

ASAP

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ASAP

 

ASAP

 

 

Receiver

1. Mintang decides to use the Daikin cooler, with a student's assistance, the preparation work for purchasing is starting now.

2.As to the OMT, there are two available sources - NRAO & Atlantic, Mintang has been contacting both of them, once he got price

information he will let Mal know.

M.T. Chen

ASAP

LO/IF

  1. Leo has not yet received the equalizer from George Gross, Mal agreed to check it with George; Leo is also considering the possibility to

transfer the IF signal by laser beam.

2.Eugene asks Warwick that is there any information about the frequency response for the 20GHz external modulator plus laser for the

photonic system ? Warwick says he has a spec. sheet, it shows for a 3dBA band, the frequency is 2 ~ 20 GHz. Eugene currently is looking

for the components for the photonic LO system, and he found the phototec laser. He thinks we don't need to use controller, so we can cut

down the price about half. We only need the narrow frequency adjustment, the original price is about 9,500USD, and the head is only

5,500USD. Warwick says this is good news, and he will close look at this spec. Eugent will finish the components list for photonic LO,

he will send it to Warwick for his review and comments. Warwick says it would be a good idea to do it as early as we can for the cost

comparison between the original LO and the photonic LO system, to make sure not to get ourselves in large cost.

3.As to the photonic delay system, T.H.Chu asks Warwick that do you think is it necessary to use the delay system for AMiBA which

mentioned in your email ? Warwick says it won't be necessary if we still use a single platform for all of the 19 antennas.

But if we use a separate mounts system, it will be really a big question about delay. T.H. asks Warwick that how long is the fiber line in

your system? And how long is the delay system itself ? is that line in your array or used in your movable fiber antenna ? Warwick says

they have not built that delay system yet, they just design it. They design a system for a 13m each base line, so as the delay system they

design, to take a ±13m delay line. T.D.Chu asks Warwick to provide the modulator information. Warwick agrees to email it to Eugene.

4.Bob confirm the traveling schedule to NRAO for Eugene & Leo has been finalized with John, it is from 25 Sep. through 6 Oct. Both

of them should raise the travel request for approval ASAP.

5.Eugene is continuing to collect more detail and precise information from vendors of Photonic LO system components.

6.As to the fiber modulator, Warwick says it is normally available up to 20GHz bandwidth, not much more than that, they are pretty

expensive items going with the multiple mounts system. He sent some information to Eugene about the cost of various components for

photonic IF system. Eugene also found some laser modulator from other vendors, they claim their modulators can up to 30 to 40 GHz

wide band. Warwick is not sure it is really available or just under developing, but he thinks the 20GHz band width is still pretty much

pushing thing, and we need to get more information about it.

7. Warwick explains the idea of step delay setting ; a coarse delay setting through the binary switchable fiber optic delay lines, and a fine delay control by a free space motor driven delay line into a modulator to retrieve the delay IF signal.

M. Sinclair

 

Y.J. Hwang

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

W. Wilson

 

 

 

Y. J. Hwang

H.C. Lu

Y. J. Hwang

ASAP

 

DONE

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

DONE

 

 

 

ASAP

 

ASAP

30 cm antenna

Michael has discussed with G.James about the mutual coupling problem between small antennas. They are going to find a single model, and to calculate on it. Graham will carry out some preliminary calculation to see if the coupling requirements have a chance of being met. Result to be available by 30 August.

M. Kesteven

30 August

Platform/mount

  1. 30m base line is suggested by Bob; Jeff says if we are going to built a step delay line units, then we should re-think it completely, it probably double of that base line, say 25m.
  2. platform vs. multiple mounts issue: Jeff wish he could do a quantitative analysis to settle this issue, but his suspicion is we can't figure it out on paper, and we really need to do a prototype to simulate it, and see what we get.
  3. Bob says the way to go with the prototype system is to build two mounts with the hexapod idea, test them as the multiple mounts system. And at same time try to use one of the mount or just track two mounts together as a platform system. We can try all of the observing techniques to get the quantitative data for sorting out what problems are. Michael says he will generate a report on Drift Scanning for AMiBA, it describes some simulation experiments.
  4. Michael says he is processing on drafting specs for AMiBA, after circulating it here he will send a copy to Bob to look at.

 

 

 

 

B. Martin

 

M. Kesteven

 

M. Kesteven

 

Agreement

Paul confirms he received two originals of the Agreement between ASIAA and ATNF, now await Fred back to sign it.

   

Travelling

K.Y. Lo/ 3 August ~ 3 September

   

Next Meeting

8:30pm EDT, 8:30am Taiwan, 10:30 Australia, 5:30pm Tucson/Thursday/31 August 2000